Cutename
trendless@Cutename nope! Some really good ones using 2 filters lately. But filters can be all sizes – both length/width and thickness – wanna have as much filtration area as you can in the footprint you want.
@trendless We're trying to build as many as we can on a limited budget. We're looking to protect a lot of people for just a few days. Any recommendations are greatly welcome. It's about 80k sq ft of assorted hotel function space total.
@Cutename can you take your time to find the best, cheapest stuff or is there a tight deadline?
@trendless Definitely on a timeline. We may have a resource for wholesale.
I've been eyeballing the two filter style, forming a triangle base for stability and safety.
I've been eyeballing the two filter style, forming a triangle base for stability and safety.
@Cutename I'd be tempted to look at single 5" filter units. Perhaps the quickest to assemble and mayyyybe competitive on price. Should have similar throughput to 4x1" filter cubes. Triangle is maybe good too, especially if 2x2" filters. Definitely get good, vetted filters tho; some real stinkers out there. Apologies if any of this is stuff you already know.
@trendless The deal is we have a bunch of box fans and a next to nothing budget. 4 + filter designs are going to leave us with more spaces without. I'm trying to find our best compromise. It's not a fun place to be.
@Cutename maybe it comes down to as many fans with even a single filter as you can. Spread it out as much as possible.
@trendless That's what I'm thinking. I did see a study that showed running undersize purifiers still offers some benefit. The event is mask and current vax required too. We're trying to do all we can, with very little.
@Cutename I'm not sure for the scenario you're describing there's any measurement of undersize for each individual unit; they'll pump out the amount of clean air they can, it's the room size that dictates if that's enough ACH. If the number of filters you have is the limiting factor, spreading them out on as many fans as possible should result in the absolute most CADR. Less fans would result in less CADR, even if the same # of filters were used, I'll bet. But I'm not an IAQ pro, so..
@trendless The study involved use of a tiny air purifier in a huge room, to clear the immediate area. As expected, the air closer to the unit was significantly cleaner than across the room.
I get ya, and agree.
Also not a pro at this - still learning.
I'm hoping to find some resource to back up my reasoning on the 2 filter style. These folks really like hard data.
I get ya, and agree.
Also not a pro at this - still learning.
I'm hoping to find some resource to back up my reasoning on the 2 filter style. These folks really like hard data.
Haplogroup News 
@trendless @Cutename There is on paper that indicates that the single filter taped to the box fan is almost as effective as the four. My experience is that the single filter gets dirty much faster. I cut free and tape on new filters every month. For something like a week long event, that would not be a detractor?
@trendless @HaplogroupNews THANK YOU! That's exactly what I expected. We're running them for 5 days. We're good! I just need to consider keeping them from being knocked over in certain locations. You rock!
@Cutename @trendless As you will have the boxes mostly intact with the single fan method, you can use it to make extended supports on the sides.
@HaplogroupNews @trendless The CR boxes have to survive being kicked, tripped over, and transported from room to room occasionally. They're going to take some abuse. I'm planning to reinforce with cable ties, but we've got to have a stable design. Something about having a safety device causing injury just seems off.
I also get to figure out how to make them visible in a darkened room. I have fun ideas.
I also get to figure out how to make them visible in a darkened room. I have fun ideas.
@HaplogroupNews @trendless I know we have regular caution tape. I'm hoping for actual lights. I want two or three of them to be VISIBLE, and hopefully a bit geeky and fun.
Folks will likely be in costume / cosplay, so we've got to be a bit extra here, at least for the dark spaces. I may have some geeky ideas for illumination that fit our safety requirements.
Folks will likely be in costume / cosplay, so we've got to be a bit extra here, at least for the dark spaces. I may have some geeky ideas for illumination that fit our safety requirements.
Paul Briley 🇪🇺@Cutename @trendless
Air filtration is important
https://www.texairfilters.com/a-mini-corsi-rosenthal-box-air-cleaner/
but so too is ventilation & air circulation. Maybe have a few fans at 90° angles with windows & doors open.
https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1446551634469924866?t=fjp1j06ys2KjtPELoijIFQ&s=09
Alternative cheap option
https://www.mpg.de/16075350/1127-chem-ventilation-made-easy-152990
Air filtration is important
https://www.texairfilters.com/a-mini-corsi-rosenthal-box-air-cleaner/
but so too is ventilation & air circulation. Maybe have a few fans at 90° angles with windows & doors open.
https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1446551634469924866?t=fjp1j06ys2KjtPELoijIFQ&s=09
Alternative cheap option
https://www.mpg.de/16075350/1127-chem-ventilation-made-easy-152990
A Mini Corsi/Rosenthal Box Air Cleaner - Tex-Air Filters
By Jim Rosenthal Many people have asked for a smaller version of the Corsi/Rosenthal Box Air Cleaner. In the spirit of the “open source” cooperative approach there have been several versions pictured on Twitter. These excellent examples inspired me to build one myself. Here is the result – a Mini-Corsi/Rosenthal Box! The fan is a ... More
@paul_briley @trendless It's an event in a hotel. We've got nothing to open and a MERV 8 ventilation system. We're very limited on budget.
We are limiting numbers in rooms, requiring masks and current vaccines, allowing for distancing, and doing CO2 monitoring.
The CR boxes are our best option.
We are limiting numbers in rooms, requiring masks and current vaccines, allowing for distancing, and doing CO2 monitoring.
The CR boxes are our best option.
@Cutename @trendless
If there're tables then mini #corsirosenthalbox per table might be better.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/interactive/2021/indoor-air-quality-safety-experiment/
Also Iota-Carrageenan nasal spray reduces viral load. Could be offered to participants.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2405580821002818
Swirling CPC mouthwash like Colgate Phlax afterwards for several days in afternoon should kill any covid in mouth.
https://youtu.be/As4bOxloC9c
Just thinking outside box in other ways to reduce risk.
@paul_briley @trendless Very interesting. I'm not sure how much we'll be able to utilize, but please do keep the ideas coming. If I can make something happen, I will.
We can't offer sprays or mouthwash due to far too many allergy and legal concerns, never mind no budget for it. We're a volunteer run .org. Dispensing such things raises its own list of materials and people points. Just so you see what I'm up against here. It's a tough job.
We can't offer sprays or mouthwash due to far too many allergy and legal concerns, never mind no budget for it. We're a volunteer run .org. Dispensing such things raises its own list of materials and people points. Just so you see what I'm up against here. It's a tough job.
@Cutename @trendless
I definitely wouldn't want to be trying to organise such as event now indoors.
Instead of offering these pharma items, maybe suggest for those keen to take extra precautions. Ppl can be so sensitive & fragile though for well meaning efforts.
Info & education does make some difference 4 some ppl.
@paul_briley @trendless We're requiring surgical masks minimum, and current vax, distancing, using CR boxes, and CO2 monitoring. sanitizer, separate food areas, prioritizing our highest risk areas, and having anyone showing symptoms leave the event - regardless of test results. We're about to call in a mitigation expert just to see what they say. It should be interesting. I've been so busy. No end in sight.
@Cutename @trendless
Surgical masks aren't good enough. FFP2 or N95 should be minimum. Surgical masks have gaps so are useless for aerosolised viral particles.
https://covidactiongroup.net/mask-fit-matters
Surgical masks aren't good enough. FFP2 or N95 should be minimum. Surgical masks have gaps so are useless for aerosolised viral particles.
https://covidactiongroup.net/mask-fit-matters
@paul_briley @trendless Unfortunately, the event doesn't feel they can require N95s as they are unable to provide them. We have a fair amount of low income attendees. We're an educational event. No one profits whatsoever. Volunteer run entirely. Unless some magic N95 fairy gifts us with a few thousand masks, it's the best I could get. We aren't allowing any nose dangling, or improper wearing, under threat of being kicked out.
@Cutename @trendless
There are some Far-UVC firms trying to promote their sanitation lighting & may install for free to prove effectiveness.
https://rzero.com/vive/
There are some Far-UVC firms trying to promote their sanitation lighting & may install for free to prove effectiveness.
https://rzero.com/vive/
@paul_briley @trendless That looks interesting. The hotel is going to have to ok that. I'm thinking they're not likely to want to promote a product, or allow anyone but their contractor to handle the electric. They're a corporate giant. We have to pay for all electric besides convenience outlets. Of course that bill is inflated greatly.
I don't mean to rain on your parade. I'm up against two corporate entities. The CR boxes were a big win.
I don't mean to rain on your parade. I'm up against two corporate entities. The CR boxes were a big win.
@Cutename @trendless
Found this. Might be useful persuasion
https://www.hotelinnovationexpo.co.uk//news/blog.asp?blog_id=38471
And this from an ABC news article online
"In addition to the Beverly Hilton, the InterContinental Hotels Group, which includes hotel brands Holiday Inn and Candlewood Suites, told ABC News they are now using UV light sanitizing technology in some of their hotels, including at the Crowne Plaza Hotel in White Plains, New York."
Found this. Might be useful persuasion
https://www.hotelinnovationexpo.co.uk//news/blog.asp?blog_id=38471
And this from an ABC news article online
"In addition to the Beverly Hilton, the InterContinental Hotels Group, which includes hotel brands Holiday Inn and Candlewood Suites, told ABC News they are now using UV light sanitizing technology in some of their hotels, including at the Crowne Plaza Hotel in White Plains, New York."
@paul_briley @trendless I may try informally asking our hotel liaison what he thinks of this. Given we're less than 2 months from the event, it's likely a maybe next year topic. I'm still waiting for the hotel to give us a simple yes / no answer on something we only require approval from them - no effort or expense involved, and it's not even an unusual request. It's been over 3 weeks.
Got anything faster to implement? Cheap is good too.
Got anything faster to implement? Cheap is good too.
@Cutename @trendless
Super cheap but hotel may not like it.
https://www.mpg.de/16075350/1127-chem-ventilation-made-easy-152990
Super cheap but hotel may not like it.
https://www.mpg.de/16075350/1127-chem-ventilation-made-easy-152990
@paul_briley @trendless Anything that has to be installed into the hotel structure is not likely to happen. If we can bring it ourselves, use it, and take it with us, it's way more of a possibility. Hotel gets complicated because of industry contracts. Convention centers are even worse. We're not big enough to have sway, or pay thousands in contractor fees. We can't even use the wrong tape.