Please understand that some of us are both optimistic and see wonderful potential here *and* don't want the same or similar mistakes to be made again.

There's so much experience to be drawn on, and it feels like excitement and optimism in technical protocols is pushing aside lessons. Everyone wants a better social network. There are real concerns.

For over 30 years we've seen the patterns and skills required when an individual starts an online community *regardless of protocol or software* and there are a bunch of invariants that have *nothing* to do with the skill of "administering and operating a software service". Community management is different from content moderation is different from system administration and we're *lucky* whenever a person or group happens to be good enough at all three.

The trite version of this is: Being an instance admin/starting one is much more for life than your regular co-opted pagan holiday now associated with a dominant global soft drink brand.

And the cost is if you get it wrong -- the different community management and content moderation parts -- then we collectively lose trust. Protocols won't ever fix that. They might make good management and moderation *easier* through tools, but they'll always be human decisions.

Like my friend @fraying said, *federation doesn't fix the problems of community management and moderation*, but it is certainly *is* a tool. It is also an exceedingly blunt one. And like many tools because it is powerful, it can also make it easy to ignore or set aside the depth, context and difficulty of decisions.

@danhon @fraying 💯 to all of this. The one thing I'd add and meant to earlier on one of @fraying's threads (but just totally overloaded) is that topological determinism *is a thing* in the corporate-owned monopoly scenario. There is only *one* outcome there, and it's "do what the landlord says." If you're lucky, he'll agree with you, but it's Machiavellian *at best*.

Here, we at least have the *possibility* to break out of that. Not guaranteed by any stretch, but *possible*.

@blaine @danhon the idea that “more landlords is better than fewer landlords” seems ahistorical to me at best. As for determinism, well, again, citation needed.
@blaine @danhon the corporate web gave us Elon running Twitter but it also gave us Craig thumbing his nose at the growth mentality and running Craigslist in a totally different way. It gave us Zuck but it also gave us Wikipedia. Saying it only ends one way is overstating things a bit.

@fraying @danhon but I didn't say it ends badly! I just said it ends, inevitably, with a landlord that you hope you agree with.

To think that this is okay is a colonial mindset, in my mind. It's hard; this is our world. Maybe it's better for most people. Indigenous people around here would disagree. 💔

@blaine @danhon Blane, you’re purposely misrepresenting what I’ve said and you’ve offended me by calling me colonial when I’ve said nothing of the sort.

It’s almost like federation hasn’t stopped you from acting like you’re on Twitter, which was my original point.

@fraying @danhon I mean, same. 💜

We've had this out before and patched it up. Let's not go down the other path.

Our job right now is to hold eachother to account. @harper has been bullying me, in a nice way, on Signal, for a while. It's good, and I appreciate the challenge.

I'm not saying you're a bad person. Far from it. You're the opposite, and I have so much respect for you.

@fraying @danhon @harper but we do have biases, and as someone who doesn't have an American passport and can't vote there, I need you to hear that when an American says that topologically centralized regulation or moderation isn't necessarily a bad thing, it lands very differently than it would if we were on equal footings from a regulatory perspective. 💜

@blaine @danhon @harper show me where I said anything like that.

And ad hominems aren’t “holding to account.”

@fraying @danhon @harper having a colonial bias isn't an ad-hominem. That frankly shitty perspective is getting anarchists banned on twitter right now. I have a colonial perspective that I have to fight against every day. I'm not attacking you; I'm saying your privilege is showing. 💜

@blaine @danhon @harper

Just stop.

If you want to be a leader in this space, which you clearly do, you need to work on the way you talk to people.

But for now, stop. This is going nowhere.

@blaine @danhon @harper And for the record, my people have been kicked out of every place we’ve ever been allowed to live, shoved into ovens and ghettos, and my father was born in a displaced persons camp after a fucking Holocaust, so calling me a colonizer (ahem “colonialist mindset”) is both wrong and fucking insulting. So maybe think twice before jumping to that line next time someone has a point that doesn’t perfectly line up with yours.

@blaine @fraying @danhon

i don’t know any of you & i apologize for weighing in on a fraught post; but i read this a few hours ago and i’ve been thinking about it ever since.

the pain & displacement you describe is real and awful, but i think it’s worth reflecting that all people of non-Indigenous descent in N. America are settler-colonizers.

the land we occupy was stolen; we’re all a little complicit. cheers,