George Takei 
🏳️🌈🖖🏽She warned us. Like Hillary, Kamala was right about everything.
Matthias Krämer@georgetakei She was wrong about what kind of platform would convince enough voters, though.
jz.tuskDo fuck off with that. Thank you.
arceuthobium@jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei nah. If shit-useless counterproductive voter shaming is going to be allowed, actual constructive criticism should also be allowed. Harris lost because she chose not to turn out the voters she needed to win, while feeding her seed corn to people who would never vote D in a million years.
@theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Did you vote for her?
@jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei Yes I did. But as I’ve pointed out elsewhere, bragging about voting for a candidate with no chance of winning is just ego masturbation.
Do you think that choosing better candidates is more or less likely to produce better outcomes than closing your eyes and wishing for a more logical electorate?
@theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
First, thanks for voting in November for the candidate with the best chance of keeping the fucks out of office. I genuinely appreciate it.
Second, I would love better candidates. But if course job one of being a politician is "win elections", so that means Joe Biden was the best candidate we've had among the last three. I wouldn't have guessed that, and I don't personally know many people who did.
....
@theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
The electorate is huge, and we have to appeal to as much of it as possible. Obama got a lot of votes from people wanting to get in on the excitement, and I'm glad we got those completely non-logical votes.
The top toot I think is directed at people who may not vote effectively out of disgust - like me! I went Nader in 2000, being certain W couldn't win. I'm pretty sure now that a Pres. Gore wouldn't have taken us into those wars.
...
@theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
I agree that hoping for a more logical electorate is foolish. But hoping for an electorate that votes more is possible.
I watched for 35 years while right-wingers voted for politicians who promised outlawing abortion and not delivering. I can be at least that persistent in voting to keep out the fascists.
@theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
BTW, for anyone who's still reading this, @indivisibleteam is currently running efforts to activate opposition to ICE, and a separate one to try to remove some of the dead wood Democratic office holders. I think those are good things to get involved in.
ᴮᵉⁿ ᴿᵒʸᶜᵉVOTE IN THE PRIMARIES@theothersimo @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
you're like that person in a relationship where it's always someone else's fault aren't you?
you vote for shit, so you don't get Trump
it's not a fucking romance
except to moron nonvoters who are so entitled they can't be bothered
either way, you can't work with people who are so complacent and entitled. the problem is not that you aren't moving them, the problem is they aren't moved. they're assholes, and that's what they need to be called
@benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei even if you were logically correct (and you aren’t) shaming voters would still be counterproductive. Everything you say about “them” applies equally to yourself but you just refuse to see it.
@theothersimo @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
the error here is this word "shame"
what?
that's emotional
the emotionality is the problem
if i tell someone they should probably clean up their room and they throw a shitfit is the problem what i said? or the immaturity of the reaction?
that's not a random analogy, that's the essential problem: entitled complacent people with an immature emotional block
do you think that problem is solved by coddling their immaturity?
that feeds the problem
@benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Emotionality wins elections.
Failure to connect emotionally loses elections.
Logic and reason teach us that logic and reason are worthless for persuading people who don’t already agree with you.
Wishing for human brains to evolve 10,000 years overnight is not pragmatic.
@theothersimo @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
the truth is we are emotional and reasonable, both
and yes: reasonable only is bullshit
but so is emotional only
if a psyop were to reduce people to their raw emotions you can effectively manipulate them
which is of course exactly what is happening
and you... what?
you love MAGA?
i don't think so
but that's the end result of what you just wrote
nonvoters and MAGA are the problem
a useless, blind, emotional soup, manipulated
easily
elala@nrw.social@theothersimo
Um, an old, emotional woman from Germany here ☝️😬 : Could everyone who would never, ever vote for the orange guy please participate in the election? The world will thank you for it.🙏 🫠
@benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Um, an old, emotional woman from Germany here ☝️😬 : Could everyone who would never, ever vote for the orange guy please participate in the election? The world will thank you for it.🙏 🫠
@benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
David Fleetwood - RG Admin@elala @theothersimo @benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei Hopefully the Dems nominate leftists this time.
@reflex @elala @theothersimo @benroyce @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Yeah, that's what was missing....
Do you somehow think that Biden was a leftist?
@jztusk @elala @theothersimo @benroyce @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei I mean, we could keep tacking to an imaginary center while also admitting we are a massively polarized nation and then being shocked our coalition isn't big enough I suppose. It's worked so well since 2000, obviously.....
@reflex @jztusk @elala @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
2000 was a lesson in the folly of the 3rd party vote. nader voters gave gwbush the win (well, the supreme court did that, but nader voters gave it to the supremes)
2024 was a lesson the folly of nonvoter. as if there was nothing at stake? oh well, "can't be bothered" because precious feelings
there is no excuse for these irresponsible assholes
MAGA is evil. 3rd party voters and nonvoters are stupid
stupid and evil work together
@benroyce @jztusk @elala @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei The answer to that is to nominate people the base will vote for. Dems have been failing at that for 25 years now. Even Obama was an accident, he wasn't who the party wanted, and then he tacked to the middle anyway.
I spent 15 years doing party organizing, a huge part of my job as a leader was trying to reassure people on the left that no, we really do agree with you but....
It won't work anymore. We go left or we lose.
@reflex @jztusk @elala @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
i agree 1,000%
still to not recognize the stakes and not vote is stupid and repugnant. who are these losers? entitled assholes is what they are
voting is just strategy in a larger war. sometimes you just need to hold the line to continue the struggle, ease the larger struggle
it's not "with this solemn vote, i do thee wed" fucking romance. so these emotionally addled ineffectual shitbag nonvoters need to be called out
Alfred J. Kwak (audiokontor) ☕@elala @theothersimo @benroyce @jztusk @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei fully sided by an unemotional old bloke from Germany, too.
@benroyce @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Ehn, I generally agree with you, but I don't think calling non-voters "assholes" to their face is effective.
I certainly say that with other voters, but that's just me being angry.
After 2024 my policy when encountering a rabid non-voter on-line is to just mute them. I'm not going to change their mind, and I think they genuinely get a kick out of being despised. They've chosen to be nothing, so I move past them seeking effective action.
@benroyce @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
Also, the person you're arguing with *isn't* a non-voter. True, you and they have different attitudes towards non-voters. Y'all are going to do what you want, but me, I'm not sure hashing out your differences there is worth the strife?
@jztusk @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
yes arceuthobium and i have butted heads on this topic a number of times
i don't care
coddling people with an emotional block does not work. full stop. on any issue in life
maybe what i am doing does not work either, but that's more an issue of how someone handles disapproval. disapproval is the correct reaction
@jztusk @theothersimo @Kraemer_HB @georgetakei
deal with these whiny ineffectual nonvoting losers however you want, i have no problem with that
but you're just restating the problem when you say "calling them assholes is ineffective"
"mean bad man called me names on social media. waah. hurt fee fees. waah. so i'm not voting"
🥴
if this where we are as a country, that people can't act *in their own interests* because their feelings are that important, we are utterly fucked. by these assholes
Dubi is here 
@Kraemer_HB @georgetakei truth doesn't have much of an audience nowadays
Steve's Place@georgetakei She was. It was identical to George McGovern warning, at the last minute, about the Republican break-in at the Watergate complex. Didn't help in either case. She needed to run a full campaign to have a chance.
derptron@steter @georgetakei She straight up didn't have a chance. Nothing she could have done would have changed that. There are certainly things she could have said and done that would have been smarter, but it was a truly hopeless cause.
Trump knew this too. Do you not recall how he was acting at the end there? Like nothing mattered at all. Like his totally empty stadiums didn't matter and he could stand there staring at the ground for 40 minutes.
Then he bragged about Musk rigging it.
Geoff Berner@georgetakei she was high in the polls when she looked like she might change things. Then she vehemently and repeatedly told us all she wouldn't. Then she lost to the worst person ever. I think that counts as being wrong about something.
Mad Dog Ace Run@Geoffberner
It counts as being wrong about the integrity of Americans. We have no integrity. We have substituted ignorance for knowledge and fear for hope. And look how well that is working for us.
And unfortunately America is still a racist and misogynistic country as well. Rather pathetic. We are definitely not great.
@BluesHarp She was going to win. She had the polling numbers. She had the money. It was her race to lose. And she lost it. She was in charge. She ran a thing, it needed to work, and it failed.
because entitled complacent losers didn't vote
according to mindless blase cynicism
that's on them
@BluesHarp @Geoffberner Yeah, when the dipshits on FoX thought they'd trap her by asking if she thought half the American electorate was stupid and shitty ... she really missed a good opportunity to, "say it like it is."
John@georgetakei too bad neither of them put together a working class platform that Americans wanted. No, they gave us more status quo nonsense that led to the election of the most electable, vile, piece of shit in US history. ... TWICE lol.
No, they do not get to do victory laps on this. They are not leaders.
you think what's been happening since last year is the status quo?
are you lying or do you not even live here?
Kamala was status quo, yes. The exact thing that got us right here. Lesser evilism doesn't work.
I'm not listening to two people that lost against Trump lol ... no clue why they're acting high and mighty as horribly failed candidates.
so you didn't like the status quo before trump (and i misunderstood what you meant by status quo, sorry about that)
neither did i
but then the solution is to sit things out and get much worse?
as for "lesser evilism":
every election ever is a choice between better and worse. same for every election ever to come. in any society. that could ever possibly exist
perfection isn't on the menu
wdym "sit things out"? I'm part of DSA, we got progressives and socialists elected locally and nationally. We've blocked fascist maniacs from infiltrating our school and library boards. I've gone face to face with Proud Boys and ICE. I march with strikers. I fight for the working class.
You believe in lesser evil. I believe we deserve better. We tried lesser evil with Biden. We got trump. how's that working for you? You are 100% wrong about it being the same for every election
John has an emotional reaction to being called out on his "lesser evilism" and blocked me
so for anyone else reading:
i wonder how the DSA will fare in a country where Trump says to just shoot them
as if that's not possible
as if choosing the dems, strategically (it's not a fucking romance) doesn't help the DSA
just tactics in a larger struggle
not "with this vote, i do solemnly wed" perfectionism bullshit
better or worse
choose
or get worse
pretty fucking simple
nieuemma@georgetakei Did it really take this long for us to figure out she was right though?
Edited because my brain was not functioning when I originally typed it
if you look at the other replies in this thread, some haven't figured it out yet, and many don't even care
Zoidberg For President@georgetakei Everybody knew it... since at least 2016...
Kamala threw fragilized populations under the bus just to try and cater to the racists fucks... she's not one to have her honor defended...
@ZoidbergForPresident @georgetakei
that's what the GOP did and is doing. so not voting makes what you say is important even worse
not exactly a tactical genius i see
@benroyce @georgetakei And in english?
@ZoidbergForPresident @georgetakei
Lo que criticas de los demócratas es precisamente lo que están haciendo los republicanos ahora mismo. Es imposible que no lo sepas. Así que no te importa y eres simplemente un trol mentiroso. Probablemente seas un seguidor de MAGA.
@benroyce @georgetakei Throwing trans people under the bus is indeed what the republicans do, so "democrats" aren't allies either.
Calling names is not a very good counter argument...
@ZoidbergForPresident @georgetakei
are you experiencing a stroke?
"yes the GOP is doing this wrong thing. it's awful. it's evil...
so anyway, let's talk about the crimes of the democrats"
is this some form of lame gaslighting or are you articulating how you have been gaslit?
LΞX/NØVΛ 🇪🇺@georgetakei it's not like she was the vice president, and had access to all the intel the US had ... but like always the naivety of US hit.
You are all Naive to think you can vote this out ... or everything will be like before IF you manage to retake power.
But you won't retake power with people walking 3 or 4 day pers year
you need strike on the whole US level to make them lose money... or it will fail
And before calling me russian bot, think why a russian bot would push you to do better
a geopolitical agenda bot knows the psyop gameplan is to sow learned helpnessness, which is what you are saying about voting. and is what got us into this mess, and is a lie about the value of the vote
whether or not you are one doesn't matter, what matters is your mindless cynicism about voting is the problem not the solution, and you are actively harming
@benroyce @georgetakei oh it seem you forgot to read.
First freak you for the mindless part at least me i can read.
Second i did give solution, but US is so entitled to think they are better they prefer to be lazy at home.
now i block you i don't tolerate rude people that insult other.
i get blocked for being rude
however, i am 100% correct about such people:
their mindless cynicism is the actual problem
then they get upset at being called out for it
they should be upset, and use that energy:
they need to fucking change their rotten piss poor attitude
they are deeply entitled, complacent people who whine and do absolutely nothing else. *that* is what got us into this mess
DonCC@georgetakei
most maggot men are misogynists so they just hate all women
most maggot men are misogynists so they just hate all women
@georgetakei yep, funding and supporting genocide was right. The dems are still supporting ice and giving them a bigger budget. When are you going to realize they are just the smiling side of the empire?
"BoTh SiDeS tHe SaMe" is just liars and morons
Taylor Silver@georgetakei I agree except kamala is pro Israel, and still pro capitalism. She'd have been one of the better presidents of all time.
noa@georgetakei Kamala said she'd do nothing different from Biden, who himself increased ICE funding to unprecedented levels.
Kamala chose to continue supporting Israel's genocide in Palestine, knowing doing so would cause her to lose the vote & enable Trump to become president.
Let's not pretend she's not part of the system that enabled our current reality.
Richard R Lee