@mrmasterkeyboard @cesarpose Granted, the valid criticism ('There needs to be X11 releases cuz people tend to use git snapshots of the master branch out of desperation') gets completely drowned by him refusing to make an unstable / devtest branch and being an asshole to the same folks that hosted his fork for a short time and ranting nonsensical shite (about 'DEI is discrimination!')…

• metux is primed to go full RMS and basically destroy any positive legacy of himself by virtue of giving everyone a finger, smoking tinfoil and then complain why noone's loving him!

https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114728168610571960

@mrmasterkeyboard @cesarpose I mean, #Xorg - like #SysVinit - both have severe issues that just ain't gonna be addressable under reasonable expectations re: hardware support, compatibility and software support.

• But there's a reason "Big Distros" and the community in general came to the conclusion that #Wayland and #SystemD are at worst 'necessary evils' and for the most part deliver a lot of quality-of-life features.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_AIw9bGogo

There is no "#conspiracy" of #BigTech wanting to kill #X11 or even sabotage #Xlibre for that matter. It's just that some folks have trouble letting go and acknowledge that #Xserver is kept on "life support" as #Xwayland so people can run their 25+ year old #Windows games in #Wine without going apeshit.

• I mean, ask @fuchsiii about that effort, where she's basically "workarounding" wine devs by literally pulling a "#Steam compatibility layer" kind of trick and swapping "good known working" Wine versions in just before launching a game because that works for setups where you have one user playing one game at a time on one machine and where shuffling around files/symlinks is possible.

@mrmasterkeyboard @cesarpose case in point:

Just because "My Little Distro" (#OS1337) runs of a single /etc/init file doesn't mean this is the "correct" or "authoritative" way to do it nor that this is scalabe at all.

• Just 'let me cook' on @OS1337 because it's more of a 'learning exercise' rather than "production grade"...

Back to #Xorg: I do think that metux's actions really salted the fields re: #Xlibre and any #X11 releases!

• Granted non-#Linux OSes like #OpenBSD already forked off or DIY'd and now moving towards #Wayland because it is the way forward just by virtue that there's hardware in stores right now that doesn't support #Xserver but Wayland...

@kkarhan @cesarpose @OS1337 I remember seeing your OS/1337 project a while back and I thought it was pretty cool if I’m honest.

Personally, I do think XOrg is dying and metux is doing NOTHING to help save it if that’s his goal.

@mrmasterkeyboard granted, given your developments I'd feel flattered of you being interest in @OS1337, given that it's "beningh" in comparison to what you did...

I don't expect people who built themselves a GUI desktop to get excited about a distro that goes like: "80x25 MDA is our resolution, 25th line is used as a status bar"...

@mrmasterkeyboard np.

To me @OS1337 is just an attempt to a minimalist #Linux distro because I want some #reproduceable & #auditable #firmware for various other projects, and both @yoctoproject and #RaspberryPiOS 'lite' seem rather excessive to me.

• Also a proper minimalist #CLI-based #distro that can be used for an "#SSH-#Terninal" does have merits.

I just think that it can have serious benefits being less distracting and allowing me (and others) to just use basically any hardware to get work done...

• The rest of the component selection came because it was either dictated by necessity (Linux has the most driver support and biggest community), alignment with values & goals ( @landley 's #toybox is a clean & minimalist userland) and being better than #GNU stuff (i.e. @musl / #musl) by not bricking shit at random minor updates…

@kkarhan @OS1337 @yoctoproject @musl I actually might try and build OS/1337 today.

I'd love to see it on the RPi4 one day, then I could replace Ubuntu Server maybe and run my Docker Gitea over Tailscale on it.

(I just had a really silly idea, but what if I put the OS/1337 userspace on the ToaruOS 2.x Misaka kernel? Probably impossible but fun to think about!)

@mrmasterkeyboard I.mean there isn't much of a userspace on it's own.

• Basically @OS1337 is @landley 's #mkroot but for bare metal as of now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58Q14ATvupo

@mrmasterkeyboard If that #kernel is mostly #POSIX-compatible it should be possible to port #toybox over there (alongside any other software one may want to get running on @OS1337), but that's as far as I know.

Not shure if @landley has the time and spoons beyond testing toybox against #Linux as he does aim to make it a better alternative to #BusyBox & #GNUtils.

@kkarhan @OS1337 @landley

To quote Kevin Lange, creator of ToaruOS:

"Is ToaruOS POSIX-compliant?
While I aim to support POSIX interfaces well enough for software to be ported, strict implementation of the standard is not a major goal of the OS, and full compliance may even be undesirable."

So, I think it could be possible!

@landley @kkarhan @OS1337 the Misaka kernel is the kernel behind versions 1.99.x-2.x of ToaruOS. I've always wanted to see Linux utils ported to ToaruOS.

I know a bit about syscalls on ToaruOS, in fact I'm even making Rust apps work on ToaruOS. I made my own syscall for ToaruOS too.

@mrmasterkeyboard @landley glad I could get you guys connected then...

I'm convinced #toybox is a good #userland to get a basic OS up and running and on it's feet. If it's good enough for #Android then it's certainly gonna be good enough for #embedded stuff as well...

• After all that seems to be the main goal of it: Allowing "self-hosting" as in building itself under itself if not deliver under the same OS...

I don't leverage that capability with #OS1337 (at least for now) but that's because I treat it more akin to how #VxWorks and #WindRiverLinux is being developed and deployed...

@kkarhan @landley I think every console since PS3 for Sony use BSD OSes so I think toybox would maybe be used on one of them.

The Switch and Switch 2 use their own OS iirc.

@mrmasterkeyboard @landley AFAIK they too use #FreeBSD parts and the #Stagefright framework from #Android to do #UI.

As for #Switch2 I expect this to be the same...

AFAIK only #PSP, #3DS and #WiiU are the last using bespoke OSes and nur a cut down/modded consumer/server OS!

• The only exception from that rule are #Xbox|es cuz being able to quickly port #Windows games over to the Xbox was the major selling point by #Microsoft and still is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_U_system_software#
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_Portable_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_3DS_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Switch_2#Software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Switch_system_software#Operating_system
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_4_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_Vita_system_software
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_5#System_software

@kkarhan @mrmasterkeyboard My switch is a dedicated skyrim machine.

Switch 2 isn't just locked down (with an alexa style microphone listening to you), they unilaterally changed their terms of service to grant themselves the right to remote brick any of them on a whim:

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2025/05/nintendo-threatens-to-brick-switch-consoles-for-hacking-piracy/

My skyrim machine has been in airplane mode since they emailed me the new TOS.

I haven't heard anything from them about OS guts, and haven't asked.

@landley @mrmasterkeyboard personally I don't bother with either.

I'm just glad @fuchsiii got her Switch with the exploitable hardware version.

@landley @mrmasterkeyboard Perdonally I'll have to look into the #Free60 project to get @OS1337 run on #Xbox360.

• I have about half a dozen I got at the end of the 7th gen era for next to nothing and I think having a minimalist distro to do some data recovery is desireable.

I have the xenon as architecture on my target architecture list.

@mrmasterkeyboard @landley @OS1337

I'd likely stick with xenon because that's the Codename for the #Xbox360 and if I use that as a short architecture handle it's pretty certsin people won't confuse it with ppc64 or anything else.

• So "OS/1337 for Xenon" because I'd not count on #Microsoft (who also own #GitHub) to not #DMCA anything that violates their #Trademarks on Xbox and Xbox 360 and avoiding any "confusion" that they could argue "it's misrepresented as an officially licensed / endorsed product" is one way to be left alone.