Molly Whitesuper cool that all these companies have decided to make customers opt OUT of having their data sold for AI training purposes
"but no one would do it if it was opt-in!"
yeah, THAT IS THE PROBLEM
bignose@molly0xfff
> "but no one would do it if it was opt-in!"
Then you don't have a business model, you have an extortion racket. Give it up before we imprison you.
Lots of people are enjoying this pithy expression of the problem (not original to me, to be sure).
I'll direct readers to someone who has better words than mine for exploring this evil shift in expectations.
https://soatok.blog/2024/02/27/the-tech-industry-doesnt-understand-consent/
#DefaultsMatter #ConsentIsRequired #DataSovereignty #OwnYourData
Derek Powazek 🐐@molly0xfff Also cool how the standard is now "give all the content to the AI companies and THEN offer the opt-out to users."
jwz@fraying @molly0xfff But but but, AI Director Spittle says: "I *believe* partners will honor this based on our conversations with them to this point."
Ethan Marcotte@molly0xfff it’s truly inspiring to see what happens when an industry with multiple decades’ worth of broken consent models gets a terrifying amount of capital dangled in front of the hot new surveillance tech
wait, not “inspiring”, the other one
Steve GisselbrechtOh, it inspires SOMETHING.
Jeff Grigg
skry@JeffGrigg @samhainnight @stevegis_ssg @beep @molly0xfff Stone “Inspire Fear” card
A purple-faced monster weaves magic.
0 and 3
Kiho Fear Water Battle: Target one of your unbowed Monks or Shugenja: Move home a target Human Personality opposing him. If the performer has the Water keyword, the Personality can not move to battlefields this turn.
"You know nothing of true horror, Crab."
TTT ILLUS. ERIC LOFGREN ™ & (c) 2007 AEG 144 o 156
🏳️🌈🜏Technomancer🜏🏳️🌈
Aleggra@stevegis_ssg @beep @molly0xfff
Inspires greed, no?
Oggie@beep @molly0xfff
Really strong 'I would never possibly break my principals unless you compensated me' energy.
Really strong 'I would never possibly break my principals unless you compensated me' energy.
Jason Garber@beep @molly0xfff “intoxicating”
Mark Hurst"You put rocks in the Fritos?? Why??"
"Well, it cuts down on manufacturing costs. Also, we allow people to opt out of the rocks."
"Opt OUT? Why not just ask people if they want rocks in their Fritos?"
"C'mon, no one would ever ask for that!"
PJ CoffeyWell some people would ask for that.
They're the people using generative AI to "prompt" and "create" things.
The fact that they're uniformly dull and uninspiring is, I'm sure unrelated to using better artists work to "join the club".
Josh Davis@molly0xfff
Apparently, when someone connects OtterAI to their Zoom and Google accts, the bot will auto-join any Zoom meeting in their Google calendar and start transcribing, whether the person is attending or not. 👍 😎
Apparently, when someone connects OtterAI to their Zoom and Google accts, the bot will auto-join any Zoom meeting in their Google calendar and start transcribing, whether the person is attending or not. 👍 😎
CMDR Yojimbosan 🅅⁂@GuerillaOntologist @molly0xfff "This was another meeting that could have been an email; oh hang on, OtterAI just sent me the transcript and a summary, so as far as I'm concerned it was ..."
@yojimbo @molly0xfff
It's creepy af. And in case it wasn't clear, this "feature" is the default behavior, so you need to opt-out of having the bot automatically eavesdrop on meetings you're not at.
It's creepy af. And in case it wasn't clear, this "feature" is the default behavior, so you need to opt-out of having the bot automatically eavesdrop on meetings you're not at.
@GuerillaOntologist @samhainnight @yojimbo @molly0xfff Today was the second time a Zoom I’m in had an uninvited bot attendee, and we’ve had to remove them from the meeting manually when discovered.
It’s awful. Moderators and meeting owners should be able to toggle that crap off. I’m about to go spelunking in the extended preferences to find out. They were supposedly realtime transcription bots, and nobody claimed them, so it’s an ugly problem.
@GuerillaOntologist @samhainnight @yojimbo @molly0xfff The two we kicked were not Otter, but I’m not sure if I captured their names.
@skry @samhainnight @yojimbo @molly0xfff
Exactly what happened to us. The person who unknowingly had a bot attending our meeting was pretty appalled and embarrassed as well. I'd say the FCC or FTC should be doing something about this, but ever since Elon's "autopilot" was allowed on public roads, it's been clear that US regulatory agencies are basically useless, so...
Exactly what happened to us. The person who unknowingly had a bot attending our meeting was pretty appalled and embarrassed as well. I'd say the FCC or FTC should be doing something about this, but ever since Elon's "autopilot" was allowed on public roads, it's been clear that US regulatory agencies are basically useless, so...
Kneworldodor@molly0xfff the UK did this with NHS data years ago. All our data is fair game to make the nobles richer. The existence and produce of the serfs belong to the lord of the estate.
Gemini6Ice@molly0xfff tbh I think a good amount of people would opt-in if they got a thing offering them $5 on Venmo to do it
Scott Andrews@molly0xfff there should be a law against unilateral amendment of a ToS.
Craig Nicol@molly0xfff and they're also mysteriously avoiding the EU, but that's absolutely nothing to do with data privacy 🤔
Led By Fools@molly0xfff
@yaelwrites made this Big-Ass opt-out list.
My questions:
What specific services need to be added to this list?
Who can write a script to do all the opt-ing out for me, given this list?
https://github.com/yaelwrites/Big-Ass-Data-Broker-Opt-Out-List
✨Yael Grauer ✨@MHowell @molly0xfff there was a project like this that's still on GitHub actually https://privacybot.io/
Option8@Option8 @molly0xfff @yaelwrites +1 for Timothy Curry in makeup from Rocky Horror.
I don't have any idea how to write such a script, but Yael posted a link to https://privacybot.io/ which is a script that has not been maintained since 2021.
Basic functionality: I would want to input one or more email addresses and have the script go set the Opt-Out on all of Yael's list.
Cybarbie@molly0xfff 💯 It's not a mistake. If you lead with 'Opt out' you *know *you are the bad guy. Let's not try to be cute.
PeteThe golden rule: treat others as you'd like them to treat you.
mlp@pete @molly0xfff better to treat them *as they would like to be treated*
that's the same thing
@pete @molly0xfff not necessarily
I can't think of an example where it isn't the same.
@pete @molly0xfff trivial: masochist enjoys pain; when interacting with a non-masochist should follow my rule not yours
This feels like arguing semantics, which, in my experience, isn't the most enjoyable of arguments.
John Mark 
☑️
craftxbox@molly0xfff Not in support of AI and data harvesting but there are *A lot* of things in software that nobody would ever opt into if they weren't opt-out by default. Less so because they don't want it, but moreso because they don't care and don't feel like expending effort to do so.
Cassandrich@craftxbox @molly0xfff Great, so don't make those things. Saves users the trouble of getting something they don't want, saves developers the trouble of making it.
Jargoggles@molly0xfff
What's the over/under on them selling your data even if you opt out?
What's the over/under on them selling your data even if you opt out?
Bill, organizer of stuff@molly0xfff I would very much like to see consumer protection legislation that preemptively outlaws doing anything to a consumer or with their data that they would have said no to had they been directly asked.
I am Jack's Lost 404I would very much like to see consumer protection legislation...
at all...
Please? 
adamrice@molly0xfff Wordpress seems like the platform of choice for SEO-hacking spam blogs that are the most enthusiastic adopters of LLMs, so maybe in this once instance, it will be a self-correcting problem.
Jesse Cail@molly0xfff Uninstalled Adobe this week because an update force fed an AI feature. Byeeeee
wraptile@molly0xfff no one does anything if it's opt in FYI. It's a broken model.
Ms.Goober (Jes)@wraptile @molly0xfff apple has a permission to track users. turns out that most people clicked deny even when the app itself nagged the user.
@Jessica @molly0xfff yeah even when user-to-dev relationship is good like in open source software big majority of users still don't opt in unfortunately.
It's a super difficult problem when ppl make it appear easy. I think for corporate software they can offer rewards (e.g. newsletter gets coupons etc) but for free software? You have to really beg and still get single percent digits of users agree :(
If I'm making free software and I need that feature you're opting out or pay me lol
🪨@Varpie @molly0xfff do they though? most people don't even know what cookies are and just click "accept" because that's the only way to get rid of the pop up.
Also considering the lengths cookie pop ups go to hide the "only functional cookies" button and try to trick the users into clicking "accept all" is prime example why opt in is not a viable strategy. It's in people's nature to trade as little as possible.
@wraptile @molly0xfff Sure, most people don't read it, but at least it's an extra step that needs to be accepted first, which we don't have with opt-out options.
And with GDPR, refusing should be as easy as accepting, so if a popup doesn't have the "accept all" and "refuse all non-necessary" buttons at the same level, they are breaking GDPR, in which case you may want to let one of the many privacy watchdog groups know, as they can take action.
And with GDPR, refusing should be as easy as accepting, so if a popup doesn't have the "accept all" and "refuse all non-necessary" buttons at the same level, they are breaking GDPR, in which case you may want to let one of the many privacy watchdog groups know, as they can take action.
@Varpie @molly0xfff I think you're conflating ideology with practical application. Unfortunately these options are not sustainable. Am I going to fill in forms for cookie pop ups now with some authorities and all of which is unlikely to change anything either way? There's a better way than just putting band aids and pretending things are fixed.
@wraptile @molly0xfff Ideologies still give fines: Facebook had to pay €60M in 2022 due to the cookies being too difficult to say no to, Google got €100M and Amazon €35M... And that's just the headlines coming from France.
Gadfly (-booq-)@molly0xfff I don't think BDSM is the answer to EVERYTHING but I do think that none of the people writing these policies have ever knowingly been within two blocks of the acronym "Freely-given, Revokable, Informed, Enthusiastic, Specific" in their life.
...
... and also that they should consider getting collared and whipped and shamed.
Kevin Karhan 
@molly0xfff Just don't even think about it at all!
Julien Barnoin@molly0xfff
Fine, we'll make it opt-in.
"Enable the setting below to opt-in to keeping your data away from our data brokers (until next time we ask)."
Patashu (Dragon Style!)honestly if it was opt out by default I'd be the only one to opt in just so all AIs would be trained on my exact mannerisms and behave like me. that'd be kind of fucking funny.
Alexander Schmidt-Lebuhn@molly0xfff "You need to let us do the thing that nobody wants us to do or we don't have a business model" is always such a great argument. An argument for something, at least, even if maybe not for the conclusion they think they are making it for.
kb@molly0xfff Make AI training opt-in and organ donations opt-out.
BrazMogu (i.e. Bruno Guedes)@molly0xfff As I tend to say, if you have to trick people into accepting your product, maybe what you have is a bunch of shit
Jared White — Free Garcia Now!@molly0xfff Old and busted: "If you're not paying for the product, you are the product."
New hotness: "If you're not paying for the product, you're training some other company's product." (and sometimes you still are even when paying for the product! 😵💫️)