Funnily enough, saving the world would also open up gigantic economic opportunities. But the people that own most of everything might get richer a little bit more slowly then. So they'll rather watch the world burn than accept change.
@georgetakei I was at Web 2.0 Summit in 2008, where O'Reilly had invited Gore for a couch talk on the opening stage.
"The arctic will have no sea ice in the summer of 2012" was one of warnings Gore wanted us to heed.
This is at best a misrepresentation
@mmalc @georgetakei I was in the audience. It was a clear statement by Gore that the scientists said the Arctic would be ice free in the summer "in five years". IIRC he said it first in 2007.
I've previously verified my recollection from a video of the event. If O'Reilly still have them up please verify yourself.
@ThreeSigma @mmalc @georgetakei "Earth is dying" is exactly one of those climate science denial statements that carry actual negative costs for a whole generation.
It isn't true. Go study some actual climate science.
@troed @ThreeSigma @georgetakei
I've been listening to actual climate science for a long time.
The *average person* however simply will not. And tearing down someone who is, for all their faults, trying to get a message across that people might pay attention to is going to “well akshully" us into catastrophe.
Again, would we be better off had people taken Gore's advice?
@mmalc @ThreeSigma @georgetakei A broken clock is correct twice a day. Gore is not someone we should heed warnings from. He doesn't accurately report climate science.
You can't base good decisions from bad facts.
The Snopes article is still there:
"Gore definitely erred in his use of preliminary projections and misrepresentations of research. Because Gore himself did not claim to have made these predictions, however, and because his statements applied specifically to summer sea ice in the Arctic, we rate the claim that Gore "predicted the ice caps will melt by 2014" as a mixture.”
Given how "alarmed" many climate scientists are about 2023, should we have heeded Gore's advice?
@mmalc @georgetakei You seem to think this is a climate change discussion. It isn't. It's about Gore not being someone to listen to if you want to know the state of climate change science.
The IPCC reports are all you need.
“Al Gore warned us some two decades ago that we faced an “Inconvenient Truth.” We didn’t heed his warnings, and now he warns us again. Will we heed it now?”
Looks like a conversation about Gore to me.
@mmalc @georgetakei From the Snopes article:
"Gore was definitely guilty in these cases of cherry-picking science or playing loose with the details of that science."
Which is the point of my comment too. Gore is not someone you want to heed climate change predictions from.
Read the IPCC reports instead.
You just wrote, “You seem to think this is a climate change discussion. It isn’t.”
And now you're arguing about climate change.
I'm well aware of IPCC reports, I'm well aware Gore was prone to exaggeration and populism.
The question is, would be be better off if we'd listened to him.
For whatever his faults, IMHO yes we would be.
I don't see the point in denigrating him and detracting from the main message.
@mmalc @georgetakei Exaggeration is science denial too. It carries actual costs in human well being. A lot of young people believe the climate effects they'll live through are worse than the climate science predicts and it takes a psychological toll.
"It’s fair to say that recently many of us climate scientists have spent more time arguing with the doomers than with the deniers" - Zeke Hausfather, Climate Scientist
Don't lift up Gore. Lift up actual climate science. Not the same thing.
Not lifting Gore up, simply not tearing down.
Just like not tearing down some climate scientists now surprised recent events shown they've underestimated some change.
For context: 1992+ was Energy Activist for local #FoE. Discovered campaigning against “Global Warming" didn't have effect I’d anticipated — much of Yorkshire was quite keen on the idea.
Pragmatism needed to get message across effectively.
Personally prefer #ClimateChaos as term to describe our future.
@mmalc @georgetakei Exaggeration is science denial just as much as playing it down.
This is the result of being pragmatic with exaggeration:
@georgetakei since acting on the warning will be more uncomfortable today than two decades ago, let me try to make a stab at an answer:
hell no!
It will be only when inaction will be more painful than action that we get our act together. Sadly.
@georgetakei the things he’s proposing are only going to buy us a little bit more time. Capitalism is the issue here and without significant degrowth and decolonization, we can’t do anything but slow this catastrophe.
Strip mining the global south to build enough renewable energy to save capitalism is not possible not to mention genocidal and ecocidal in its own right.
I wish Showtime would bring back James Cameron’s and Arnold Schwarzenegger’s Years of Living Dangerously.
Every episode featured a celebrity traveling first hand to a spot on Earth where different climate change topics were covered in depth through interviews with officials and people affected by or about to be affected by different aspects of climate change.
I often try to imagine what the world would look like, if he had won the presidency. Not that the guy is in any way perfect, but compared to what we got instead things would have turned out so much better.
@georgetakei
Let me give you a Magic! answer here:
And likely Mars, too. We need our socialist, Star Trek future now! Fuck these greedy capitalists.
@AnotherDayInHell @georgetakei
Republicans are pro-Russia, which explains why they favor global warming.
Climate Change and Russian Agriculture
Update Date: 24 Jan 2022
https://encyclopedia.pub/entry/18679
How Russia Wins the Climate Crisis
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/12/16/magazine/russia-climate-migration-crisis.html
Agricultural area in Siberia will expand due to climate change
13 December 2019
https://ksc.krasn.ru/en/news/agricultural_area_in_siberia_will_expand/
Agroclimatic potential across central Siberia in an altered twenty-first century
3 November 2011
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/6/4/045207
encyclopedia.pub
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