MOVED [email protected]

oh, here's some JUICY rumored details about meta's plans for the fediverse

tl;dr "Meta will only federate with select larger instances from the beginning. There will be contracts which also provide for financial compensation for the instance owners."

can't entirely verify their validity but it's still worth posting just in case

#FediPact #barcelona #project92 #p92 #meta #facebook #fediverse #fediblockmeta #FediAdmin #MastoAdmin #threads

Jun 23, 2023 at 2:59pmWeb
Show threadMOVED [email protected]Jun 23, 2023

y'know if this is true that makes The Pact's mission easier actually

all we have to do is convince big instance admins to not sell out lol

Show threadMOVED [email protected]Jun 23, 2023

like

i think it might be a bit easier

to get a handful of large instance admins on board with being against meta

rather than as much of the fediverse as possible lmao

Show threadMOVED [email protected]Jun 23, 2023

then again

maybe not lol

Show threadJon (now at neuromatch.social)Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack most of the large European instances are run by cis white guys with a "growth mindset" so don't hold your breath. But honestly I think the fedi we want will be better without them so let them make their choices.
Show threadFancy SandwichesJun 23, 2023
@jdp23 @vantablack yeah, the growth at all costs folks are not, and never have been, on the side of the community. They want to have a big instance because they want a big following. They want to feel important.
Show threadThe ShinxposterJul 4, 2023
@vantablack Problem is a lot of larger instances have huge financial pressure to get funding from Meta
Show threadDoc Edward Morbius ⭕​Jun 23, 2023

@vantablack Money has pull.

Or does it suck? I can never keep it straight.

FB has, as I noted in an earlier toot, insane gobs of wealth.

Using it to buy out Quislings and Judas Goats seems like the strategy they've settled on.

I'm ... thinking of how that might be subverted.

Show threadEriJun 23, 2023

@vantablack It could have the opposite effect of people wanting to make their instances as large as possible to make money.

Thankfully I don’t see it affecting smaller instances with trustworthy admins.

Show threadC.W. Smith 🇺🇲Mar 22, 2024

@vantablack

Part of the issue is that little problem of resources.

It's one thing for me to spend $12USD a month for a VPS to run one single person instance.

It's another thing for the major 800 pound gorilla's on the network whose resources are stretched thin and scaling becomes a problem.

It's actually why I have little respect for people who mock others for paying for X.

Yeah, it was free to you but it was never really free. People paying for a service they find value helps the servers.

Show threadunlofl [Promoted Toot]Jun 23, 2023

@vantablack ugh, I'd wondered about that. Step 1: make large instances financially dependent on zuck step 2: intertwine the social graphs step 3: do anything they want because you need us and your users will be mad if you defederate!

This is gonna be a one-sided relationship, and whatever zuck offers will be gradually withdrawn to shift costs back onto instances. It will be a little like streamers, over time the deal will get worse and worse for anyone except the biggest.

Show threadunlofl [Promoted Toot]Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack but maybe it's a useful line in the sand: defed servers who take the money, it's a conflict of interest in moderation. Trust user-funded servers that are transparent about funding, not whoever says it's no big deal don't worry about it but won't get specific because of an NDA.
Show threadAlex@rtnVFRmedia Suffolk UKJun 23, 2023

@unlofl @vantablack

surely it will be very easy to catch instances which do this? All you would need to do is sign up as a new user on them and compare the UI / code / data traffic - to get the ads in it will be noticeably different between a "Meta" instance and a normal one...

Show threadcuan_knaggsJun 23, 2023
@vantablack that "all" is doing a lot of work there
Show threadMatt CampbellJun 23, 2023

@vantablack

> can't entirely verify their validity but it's still worth posting just in case

I disagree. I don't think it's good to spread unverified rumors.

Show threadshorkJun 23, 2023
@vantablack well lookie here, suddenly allowlist federation is fine
Show threadshorkJun 23, 2023
@vantablack (they'd absolutely DOS most instances to hell if they tried lmao)
Show threadMatthieuJun 23, 2023
@vantablack If we believe the email shared by the admin of fosstodon, the meeting didn’t even happen yet. So maybe don’t repost slanders and baseless rumors?????

I thought the fight against fakenews was among the things we did better than GAFAM?
Show threadhybrid havocJun 23, 2023

@matthieu_xyz
@vantablack
Don't you know it's okay to get people riled up with unverifiable rumors so long as you don't use the word "news"?

Fewer questions, more pitchforks!

/sarcasm

Show threadHughsterJun 24, 2023
@hybridhavoc @matthieu_xyz I can understand an activist account with a vested interest in campaigning to stop anyone federating with Meta spreading this stuff. Large accounts who should know better boosting it to tens of thousands of followers, not so much.
Show thread Why Not Zoidberg? 🦑Jun 23, 2023

@vantablack Pretty much what I guessed a few days ago:

Federation in exchange for payment.

Show threadRob BosJun 23, 2023

@vantablack
Funding models are going to be key for larger instances. Being dependent on Facebook will be very tempting but will definitely fuck us all in the long term, it is unacceptable leverage.

Societies, coops, aggressive donation soliciting, formal nonprofits, all are going to be important. Fair compensation for labour also has to come into it. Large instances will have to be professionally managed, and that means expertise.

Show threadJustin StanleyJun 23, 2023
@vantablack Oh boy. This doesn't sound good.
Show threadJohn [He, Him, His] 🌈👨🏼‍🔬🧬🧫🧪💻Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack definitely getting that #enshittification vibe here
Show threadSupportive Tree-based lifeformJun 23, 2023

@vantablack
I think the pressure masto puts on admins is possibly too high and Meta saw this as a weak point, if true. Truly a soulless monster corporation.

I don't think this is a problem solved with just words. There needs to a transparent funding of method for instances that would force disclosure of paid instances.

Show threadWanderingBeekeeperJun 23, 2023
@vantablack
The English steel we could disdain
Secure in valor's station
But English gold has been our bane
Such a parcel of rogues in a nation
Show threadHoppmester Fønvind SnubleblussJun 23, 2023
@vantablack This will backfire tremendously. AP does not provide for this, and if they manually X-List/A-List instances, whole threads will be torn apart. Which, in turn, means unhappy Meta sheep... errm... users.
Show thread@[email protected]Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack This is horrific if true. Really hope they can resist the temptation of money. People can easily talk themselves into believing it's for the good of the #Fediverse to do that as having more money allows them to grow and scale the Fediverse, but this is a pact with the devil.
Show threadophiocephalic 🐍Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack
It would seem to be evident that if this is true, the fediblock should be extended to any instance which agrees to paid absorption into the Zuckerberg entity
Show threadryanJun 23, 2023
@vantablack
This answers a large question I had about how Meta would federate (if at all) and keep their moderation and content rules intact. Only federating with instances that follow their rules is perfectly sensible and reasonable from their perspective.
Show threadarkywarkyJun 23, 2023
@vantablack UFoI lmaooo
Show threadMiKlo:~/citizen4.eu$💙💛Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack If there's even 20% truth in it, they deserve nothing more than a big kick in the ass.
Show threadEvan MintoJun 23, 2023
@vantablack lmao this is so ludicrous and obviously not true, come on. This person is SPECULATING. They're inventing a situation that fits their narrative — Meta paying admins of the eeevil big instances — then getting mad about it.
Show threadTom RitchfordJun 24, 2023

@VamptVo @vantablack

How is it obviously not true?

Meta is wanting instances to carry a lot of new traffic. It makes economic sense to compensate the instances for this traffic, particularly given Meta's deep pockets.

(No reasoned statement ever started with "lmao", and CAPS are also a bad look...)

Show threadEvan MintoJun 24, 2023
@TomSwirly @vantablack Show me literally any evidence for it and we'll talk. One person holding a flashlight under their face and telling you Meta is paying the website boy doesn't mean anything.
Show threadEvan MintoJun 24, 2023
@TomSwirly @vantablack Also, in response to your point about my use of language and caps: lmao
Show threadTom RitchfordJun 24, 2023

@VamptVo @vantablack

You said: "this is so ludicrous and obviously not true" but provided no argument.

So I gave an argument as to why it was in fact quite plausible, but you provide no argument.

Show threadkaty ✨Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack So basically they partner with several larger instances and compensate them while starving out smaller instances long enough to buy the larger ones out and integrate them into Meta's instance, thus defacto controlling the Fediverse.
Show threadAndrewJun 23, 2023
@vantablack paying instances for running meta ads? This is worse than I ever imagined.
Show threadSP⟁CED GO⟁TJun 23, 2023

@vantablack

Imagine being so unlikeable that you have to pay other instances on the fediverse to play with you.

Show threadSP⟁CED GO⟁TJun 23, 2023
@vantablack legit buying friends.
Show threadJaime HerazoJun 23, 2023
@vantablack
In a Lemmy thread somebody described how it'll end if/when they enter, and i hate it: https://beehaw.org/comment/411246
I hate it and i fear this is exactly how it'll go
How to Kill a Decentralised Network (such as the Fediverse) - Beehaw

This blog post by Ploum, who was part of the original XMPP efforts long ago, describes how Google killed one great federated service, which shows why the Fediverse must not give Meta the chance

Show threadEric McCorkleJun 23, 2023

@vantablack

Rules for moderation seems like a no-go condition. There's a line between federation and vassalization

Show threadWokebloke for DemocracyJun 23, 2023
@vantablack
Donate to your Mastodon!
Show threadLarry GarfieldJun 23, 2023

@vantablack So it sounds like the answer is "figure out a way to fund instances and admins fast, before FaceMeta buys them out."

Which mean, hey people reading, pony up cash for your home server before Zuckerberg does. Especially if you're on a large server.

The ball's in your court.

Show threadApicultor 🐝Jun 23, 2023
@vantablack Why is this hashtagged "Barcelona"?
Show threadSandip Bhattacharya ☮️Jun 24, 2023
@vantablack how are they marking ads as different from posts for the servers to filter on?
Show threadThaiis Thei 𓁟Jun 24, 2023
@vantablack Get instance owners addicted to buckets of FB money. Later, suddenly withdraw money. Profit.
Show threadKazii The AvaliJun 24, 2023
@vantablack what people in this comment thread is not taking account of is how easy it is to up and move. if the instance you are in does accept metas offer or doesn't defenderate with meta it'll be ovious and you can just up and leave.
Show threadParanoid FactoidJun 24, 2023
@vantablack Any large instance that federates with meta and takes meta's money should be defederated by everyone else immediately.
Show threadChristoJun 24, 2023
@vantablack
I left FB, I will have to leave Mastodon.social if it links with Meta
Show threadmyrmepropagandistJun 24, 2023

@vantablack

Thanks. I hate it.
But at least this kind of solves the question for smaller instances of federating or not with them.

Not federating with small instances is missing the whole point. It's making a web browser that only goes to big sites, or email that only emails huge domains.

It's a pretty transparent effort to wrestle power back if true.

Show threadCautionWIP 🎃+🇨🇦+🏳️‍🌈= Jun 24, 2023
@futurebird @vantablack I’m leery of getting too worked up over a rumour, but that doesn’t mean I think it’s impossible, nor does it change the amount of trust that should be extended to Meta, which remains 0.
Show threadRobinJun 24, 2023
@cautionwip @futurebird @vantablack Meta’s bread and butter is being a monopoly that controls a mysterious algorithm. Federating with small servers 100% undermines that. Thank you for clarifying that.
Show threadBenjamin HandelmanJun 24, 2023
@vantablack this person literally says “don’t take this at face value”.
Show threadAndrea JemmettJun 24, 2023
@vantablack then maybe financially supporting your instance admins (if you’re able to) is even more important in this context
Show threadRyan MannJun 25, 2023
@vantablack @weirdwriter There’s the problem. If there were no non-disclosure agreements there wouldn’t be roomers because everything would be in the open. If Meta isn’t doing anything shady, then why the non-disclosure agreements?
Show threadOrca 🌻 | 🎀 | 🪁 | 🏴🏳️‍⚧️Jun 25, 2023
@vantablack "savior" LMFAO, go to hell Meta 😅
Show threadMattJun 25, 2023
@vantablack not sure what i think of this, there's a bunch of that smells bad, selective federation, financial compensation and ad pushing 😕 I now see why people are thinking about blocking from the start which is quite upsetting